True For Me True For You
I made a comment last Sunday that several people have commented on. I came to the conclusion a long time ago that if a “truth” doesn’t work in all situations, then it isn’t truth. It might seem true. But if it isn’t true for everybody, then it isn’t true, ultimately, for anybody. This applies to theology. If it isn’t true for everybody, then it isn’t true for anybody. That’s why much of our western theology is poor. Much of what is taught in churches and in our books today seems true, but only if you are middle-class or better and live in North America or Europe. If someone says to me that God would not let me go hungry or bankrupt or die by brutality, that’s a lie! He obviously lets many people go hungry and bankrupt and die of brutality. This line of reasoning, as harsh as it may be, must apply all the way down the line. If it is true for me, it must be true for a starving Aides orphan in Darfur or a Christian in China locked away in a solitary cell never to be heard from again. Some people think that some of the best theology these days is coming out of third-world countries. I believe it, because it is less likely to be tainted by comfort- and success-oriented thought patterns that enamour us.The fine art photograph is the creation of my friend Mark Hemmings.
Tags: church, naked, pastor, philosophy, theology, truth
Another good one, David. You seem to be on a roll.
My love and affection for this simple truth is not a secret. When you print it on a t-shirt, I’m buying.
I read a letter to the church that came from the Bakers in Africa a couple weeks ago. In it they talk about coming upon a refuge camp that included many followers of Jesus who had lost everything in flash floods. People were naked, starving, without shelter and the Bakers had limited supplies. But they gathered and prayed and sang and danced and gave away everything they had and then left and went for more supplies, knowing that some of their brothers and sisters wouldn’t live to see them come back with more.
I say we air drop all the TV evangelist in the world into Mozambique and let them pray, tithe and miracle spring water themselves out.
As you said in an earlier post, God is beyond science, beyond knowledge, beyond proof. Truth is not far behind. It is known in someone’s soul, in the depths of their being, and cannot be argued.
A Christian sitting in a cell in China will not have the same experience as a middle class immigrant in the US. And so what is true for the prisoner, will not be true to the immigrant.
If we could find the greatest common denominator, that would be True, but I don’t know that many people are looking.
In Spirit,
Nneka
David, you might be interested in this post which was on Next Reformation yesterday http://nextreformation.com/?p=1468 it was on similar lines to yours – I commented there, so won’t do the same here!
Hop on the liberation theology bandwagon!
Sooo….lets see….experience and truth now have to match. Soooo….if my experience does not match up to yours, then my truth may be better/lesser truth than yours? Or is just different truth? Is there really truth at all? Keep reading…
I think this is why the Church Fathers wrote Creeds. We can assent to them as describing the basics of belief. They are simple enough to memorize and for most pedestrians to understand.
The application of this truth may be differing on where you are. Obviously the naked flood victims cannot worship with full priestly regalia. Neither should we rich folk demean the poor for not worshiping God “properly” in our methods.
Truth breeds Humility.
Anna: I’m not sure who you are responding to. I agree that experience is different for different people. That’s a given. But truth can’t be. What I mean is: if someone says God will always give you three meals a day, this is not an ultimate truth. It might be superficially true to me, but not fundamentally true about God, because obviously he doesn’t provide three meals a day to everyone. I think we agree.
Truth is a tricky concept. Philosophers have grappled with the question of what truth is for millenia. This wikipedia entry does a good job of listing the many ways of which truth can be thought – http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Truth
In general, the correspondence theory makes the most sense to me. Truth is what corresponds to reality. In this conception, there is no such thing as something being true for one person and not true for another. It is either true or it isn’t. Whether we can know what is true with absolute certainty is another question entirely.
Aahhh….I see…I guess I call them “truth claims” instead of Truth with the captial, representing what is eternal. Gotcha.
Glad to see we are on the same page.
Yep. I believe your observation is true.
I think the reason that many people struggle with this is that they live under the mistaken notion that acute pain, extended suffering, and, untimely, death are the worst things that can happen to us. That is a fallacy.
Thank you thank you thank you for stating this observation. Also, I liked what Barry Pike had to say.
Dave, your right!
Is it TRUE that the force of gravity affects us all, on this planet? I suppose people would agree that that is true…
Then why is the EXPERIENCE of it so different for a child learning to walk, than for an eagle soaring above us? Does gravity not pull on the eagle?
Or, is it a highly complex thing, to try to determine the truth of something by observing different experiences of it?
Whether I believe in gravity, or not, the truth is that it will continually affect my life – in ways that can sometimes be observed, by some people, and in ways that can’t be.
What I learn about gravity and how I choose to interact with it (which will be affected in part by my circumstances) can radically change my experience, but not the truth of it.
Should I feel ashamed that I haven’t purchased an airplane and learned to fly, like others have? Should I criticize the eagle for having advantageous circumstances? Should I doubt God’s fairness towards toddlers since they weren’t born with all of the skills to walk smoothly without falling?
Daniel emerged from the Lion’s den unharmed, but many of Jesus’ followers were martyred. I don’t think that the God who persuaded hungry lions not to eat Daniel – was unaware of Stephen’s and Paul’s dire circumstances, or uninterested. I don’t think He ‘liked’ Daniel better, or that Daniel’s situation was one of comfort and ease.
I think there were many factors involved.
My Dad died slowly of cancer, while my Mom prayed and believed God that he would be healed. I don’t know why he wasn’t healed.
I’ve never read that Jesus turned some one away, who came to Him for healing, in faith. Does that mean that I doubt my parents’ faith? Actually, I consider their experience to be something that I shouldn’t judge. I shouldn’t judge them, or God, for it.
Whatever happened or didn’t happen, between them and God – depended on them and God. Maybe Dad didn’t believe God would heal him, or maybe he came in fear instead of faith. Maybe Dad had caught a revelation about God that made him so eager to get to heaven that he never wanted to be healed! Maybe he quietly harbored some sin and felt unworthy to ask for healing.
Maybe he’d watched some one he loved die, and assumed that God only healed people ‘when He felt like it’, and so, having no faith for healing, arrived early in heaven. (When Jesus got to a place where the people had no faith, He performed very few miracles.) The possibilities are countless.
I have allergies, I’ve pulled my rib many times, I had a head cold 2 weeks ago. I have acne rosacea. I believe God would love to have me walk healthy every day of life, even though I experience health in a typical, normal way.
But – I have been healed by God. Not of everything, but of one thing that is serious enough for me to make the effort to believe God – to keep my faith in Him on the topic strong. And, anytime symptoms return (6 months out of 17 years), I go and read what God said about healing, instead of saying, “Oops – guess I was wrong about God on that”. I believe what I’ve learned about God’s nature, through the Bible, rather than my symptoms or experience.
Isn’t it okay if God meets each one of us at the point of our own faith? Do I have to see evidence in people’s circumstances to know what God’s like, or can I accept that what I receive from Him depends on me, and Him, and our relationship, and my life, and my fears, and my failures…
I believe God is good, and that He loves us, and that He wants to bless us – in our circumstances all over this world. But when Adam & Eve sinned, they forever changed the planet and how things work on it. We don’t get to walk in the cool of the garden, unaware of our nakedness, talking with Him each night. There is disease and sin, and poverty and violence and a whole lot more. Our relationship with Him is personal, just like our circumstances – and so we’ll each have a different experience with Him.
He’s not playing ‘favourites’. But the Christians in Chinese prisons are in different circumstances than people starving in third wold countries, and than people in North America with healthcare and homes and food…
Comparing to gravity – my kids can play ‘blind man’s bluff’ in the backyard quite safely, but don’t try it on a rooftop – in fact, on a rooftop, you probably won’t play many games at all – you’re probably there for a specific purpose. And, if you are on a plane that’s going down hard, the results you experience aren’t going to be as significantly affected by your choices and actions. But the same gravity is present, and pulling in every circumstance. The truth of it is unchanged, regardless of which experience you have…