Check out my tees HERE and my art HERE.
If you like this post, or if you'd like to use it, consider buying me a beer.
-
David Hayward is an artist trapped in a pastor's body, stripping to the essential.
-
Check out my tees HERE and my art HERE.
If you like this post, or if you'd like to use it, consider buying me a beer. David Hayward is an artist trapped in a pastor's body, stripping to the essential.
You are alive in Christ…that is what matters, which makes me wonder…Are you surrounded by the walking dead??
Okay, this comment has nothing to do with today’s post (though it did make me laugh as I’ve been there, on both sides of the web, sad to say!), but I just visited your art site where you sell your art (http://www.etsy.com/shop.php?user_id=5317688) and had to tell people to think about heading over there for Christmas shopping. The cards are gorgeous! The art is incredible and you have everything so well priced that it’s completely do-able.
Disclaimer: I don’t know David, have never met him, and don’t get anything for saying the above.
I just wanted to draw people’s attention to it because I have long enjoyed this site but just now stumbled upon his art work for sale….
I bought one of his pieces and it is terrific!
Now, back to the post…Staying alive in Evangelical America is what it’s about. The goal is NOT TO DIE.
Jesus said if you would gain your life in this world you must lose it. We need to die. That’s what God’s Law is all about. We die each day (in little ways) as sin, the world, and the devil do their work on us
But as MistiPearl points out, “you are alive in Christ”. As we die each day…we are raised each day. That is what Luther meant by “returning to our baptism’s each day.
That is the Christian life. That is the work of Christ on the cross (for us). That is exactly what happens in baptism. Death…and resurrection.
Welcome to Christianity… here’s your cross.
Oh what a tangled web we weave…when we…uhm…when we…uh…get stuck in it? LOL
My Lord, it is not that tough, try the door.
fishon
fishon,
Welllll… that’s sounds just a bit too convenient!
fishon,
Nice one!
Man! This is all about perspective…disappointment=opportunity
or if one door closes another opens
then again, you can always try to sweet talk the spider….nah…
…in some churches,it’s hard to find the door when yr mind and will have been sucked empty by theologies that destoy yr soul….wolfspiders in sheep’s clothing
I guess it is just beyond me why anyone would allow themself to get to the point of::::”when yr mind and will have been sucked empty by theologies that destoy yr soul….”
I am sorry I am so dense, I just do not get it.
Many on this blog site make it sound as if you have allowed pastors/churches to put a nose ring in your nose and lead you around till you died spiritual or are just about dead. Wasn’t there a time when you thought, “Fool me once shame on you; fool me twice, shame on me?”
I am sorry, so many attack the/a church, and in many cases rightfully so–but what of personal responsibility?
I just do not understand.
fishon
Well,the post was in reference to those who are caught and can’t find the door….seriouly Fishon….ponder a minute…the world is overflowing with religions,cults,churches,etc.,whose adherents have lost their ability to think rationally and behave responsibly….not all of course,but many
Oh I think I feel that way about Christianity in general some days. Too often now. After all, after all this – I think if I live long enough I’ll end up in Hell (or really if I die too soon).
I’m not sure who I think the spider is though. And maybe the web is safer than falling through the air?
The church members contribute to the church too, all the blame for a sick church can’t be laid on the pastor.
I really really hope my pastor’s not responsible for me.
Semety…maybe you shld erase the board and start over…if what you believe about God and faith is destroying yr soul,then find the courage to walk away…nobody can give you their hope…you must find yr own…someday,you might find yrself out of that hell you are in.
faithlessinfatima,
Oh I understand that folks get caught up in cults and such–but it is beyond my comprehension that they, as you say, “…have lost their ability to think rationally and behave responsibly….”
And I especially am bafflled that Christians would allow themselves to be abused, as so many atest to happening to them, by churches/pastors.
fishon
….slightly lower than the angels Fishon and very complex
What an interesting cartoon, today. I’ve been thinking about it for several hours now.
If you view the web as the institutional church–a tool for the spider to catch unsuspecting victims–then the dark, looming spider must be the ones who “weave” and “maintain” the sticky institution. In this case, the only way for a “victim” to be free is for the spider to die and for someone to venture along and smack down the sticky web, hopefully freeing the soon to be corpses. What appears to be life is death.
If you view the the web as universal church–a tool for the spider to catch and wrap up sins and selfishness–then the big spider must be God who is the only one who can trap such things and forced them into submission. In this case, we wouldn’t want the victims to be free and we would be actually be partners with God in weaving and maintaining the web that traps what ought to die. What appears to be death is life!
And I especially am bafflled that Christians would allow themselves to be abused, as so many atest to happening to them, by churches/pastors.(fishon)
Many people who come to the church are hurting. And the bulk of them suffer from low self esteem. They are perfect bait for the spiders. And dont kid yourself, the church is no different than the secular world, theres just as many spiders waiting to suck your guts out.
“And the bulk of them suffer from low self esteem.”
———–And you know this, how? Easy to generalize–but you have no facts.
“And dont kid yourself, the church is no different than the secular world….”
———–And you know this how? Easy to generalize–but you have no facts–that is unless you have investigated the over 400,000 churches in USA.
“theres just as many spiders waiting to suck your guts out.”
———–And you know this how. Easy to generalize—-How many spiders have you identified within those 400,000+ churches?
You love to throw out generalizations, and you have in the past–but you have no proof for your cute little accuzations.
Yep, there are a few spiders–but then there are a few Doctors who are spiders–so that makes all or even most Doctors spiders? No!
“”And dont kid yourself, the church is no different than the secular world,”"
————-Kid my self. Hardly. I have lived in the secular world as a drunk and brawler–now I live within the power of the Holy Spirit because of Jesus–”Kid my self.” I been on both sides, friend, not the same world. And not the same world because you say so.
By the way–how’s your self-esteem? Generally, when someone points out that millions upon millions “…the bulk of them suffer from low self esteem.” have low self esteem, that might just be an indication of the accusser’s self esteem.
fishon
How do you tell when the wrapping starts anyway? It’s subtle and not like the spider just walks up to you and bites you on the butt. That’s the thing isn’t it…by the time you figure it out it’s too late….your guts have been sucked out!!
fishon: you still like to fight.
Kid my self. Hardly. I have lived in the secular world as a drunk and brawler–now I live within the power of the Holy Spirit because of Jesus–â€Kid my self.â€(fishon)
fishon
You prove my point with this statement.
Read it again. “Many people who come to the church are hurting. And the bulk of them suffer from low self esteem.” Tell me when you came to the church as a Drunk and a Brawler, did you have good self esteem? Oh and by the way, most Brawlers rarely get taken advantage of after they know how to fight.
Fishon,
I think you may still have what is known in some circles as an “alcoholic mind”. I also was a drunken, drug addicted brawler and recognize it’s lingering effects in your attitude.
Greggmac – what’s that mean exactly? An “alcoholic mind”?
Very serious question…
Laura
Another term would be “Dry Drunk”. A person who still has their demons but dont drink any more.
Some people are like the Bible:…..sometimes foot washing….sometimes foot stomping
So T4T- hmmmmm….is that common?
Here’s an even more important question…do alcoholics that quit drinking find other ways of being addicted? Do you think it’s possible that someone could be addicted to church for example?
“So T4T- hmmmmm….is that common?” (Laura)
I think it is common – people that kind of suffered from the addiction – even after the fact. I once heard that someone who drinks when they are young and quite when they are older – suffer from a type of physchology problem – where they recognize more with that person they were before they drank (and haven’t grown up so to speak – syunted their emotional and mental growth). I would say there is some merit to this claim.
Laura….
“Do you think it’s possible that someone could be addicted to church for example?”
I remember a Christian psychologist telling me many yrs ago…”The essence of addiction is loss of will”
Bingo!!!!!!
Laura and Societyvs
Addicts seem to have some common traits. Addictive personalities tend to be one of them. Anything can be overdone, even church. Now how do I know all this, you may ask? I own it, so its easy to recognize.
FinF- I was thinking more along the lines of someone who is a recovering alcoholic just replacing the addiction for drink with one for church or church service, but I definately see your point too!
But are you saying you think all of christianity is an addiction or just some?
SocietyV- good points as well!
Looked up “dry drunk” and some of the stuff there is very telling. Interesting especially on this particular post…
fishon: you still like to fight.
On his behalf, thank you for allowing that, and accepting him for who he is.
Ahhh, freedom to disagree, and to express it IS refreshing!
Laura…”But are you saying you think all of christianity is an addiction or just some?”
Of course not,but more common than many wd admit….addictive types use food,relationships,alcohol,drugs,sex/pornography and even church to cover their emotional pain ….the principle is “pleasure pushes pain away”….so,are we masking or de-masking…that is the question?
fishon
You prove my point with this statement.
Eek, one case and the hypothesis is proven!
I think you just proved HIS point.
Well,the post was in reference to those who are caught and can’t find the door….seriouly Fishon….ponder a minute…the world is overflowing with religions,cults,churches,etc.,whose adherents have lost their ability to think rationally and behave responsibly….not all of course,but many
This is a generalization, but I’ve come to suspect that a great many of humans do not, or rather preferred not to think for themselves. It’s comfortable and easy to let others do the thinking for you, to put them on a pedestal. At least if they’re wrong, it’s THEIR fault, not YOURS!
Why are obvious verses like, “Watch out for false prophets. They come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ferocious wolves,” “Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits” and the likes overlooked?
I liked it when C.S. Lewis said:
The proper motto is not “Be good, sweet maid, and let who can be clever,” but “Be good sweet maid, and don’t forget that this involves being as clever as you can.” God is no fonder of intellectual slackers than any other slackers.
I’ve once heard someone said that, “if the Bible is not infallible, what can we rely on???” or something like that. I can almost hear many saying, “if my pastor is not infallible, who can we rely on???”
But to be fair, I cannot say that I’ve never encountered pastors who act as if they know everything, and as if everything that proceed from their mouth is from the Holy Spirit. But then again, that looks like a sort of attitude that is prevalent in humans, especially elder Asian folks. (don’t know about non-Asian ones; I’m Chinese)
nakedpastor said, on November 21st, 2008 at 7:07 am
fishon: you still like to fight.
———And you still like to start um.
fishon
TitforTat,
When I start attending church, yes, I was hurting. However, I can’t say as if I had a self-esteem issue. Of course, some would analize that and say that if a person said they don’t have a self-esteem problem then they are prideful. Can’t win for losing.
fishon
Laura said, on November 21st, 2008 at 12:09 pm
Here’s an even more important question…do alcoholics that quit drinking find other ways of being addicted? Do you think it’s possible that someone could be addicted to church for example?
———–Oh yes, Laura. There are lots of people who are addicted to being at the church all the time. Sadly, there are pastors and staff that take advantage of those who are addicted. I pastor a very small, rural church, so the chances of people feeding that addiction are minute.
fishon
TitforTat said, on November 21st, 2008 at 11:25 am
Laura
Another term would be “Dry Drunkâ€. A person who still has their demons but dont drink any more.
———Praise the Lord, Jesus has destroyed all my demons.
fishon
Greggmac said, on November 21st, 2008 at 9:13 am
Fishon,
I think you may still have what is known in some circles as an “alcoholic mindâ€. I also was a drunken, drug addicted brawler and recognize it’s lingering effects in your attitude.
———-And you can tell that by my writing? YOU ARE GOOD.
fishon
Zefi said: This is a generalization, but I’ve come to suspect that a great many of humans do not, or rather preferred not to think for themselves. It’s comfortable and easy to let others do the thinking for you, to put them on a pedestal. At least if they’re wrong, it’s THEIR fault, not YOURS!
——-Zefi, you just struck the nail on the head several blows. When I first started attending church, I remember the pastor telling the congregation, “Check out what I say; check out what I teach and make sure it lines up with scripture. If I teach you something biblically that is not scripture call me on it.”
I tell the congregation I pastor that same statement at least 6 times a year. I can not tell you how many times in Bible studies that I have said, “The Bible says,” only to have someone ask “Where does it say that?” And off we go to find it.
You are right, though, most people like to lay the foundation of their problems at the feet of others. However, there is a time when we can’t blame others {Mom, Dad, Preacher, Teacher, etc} for how we act and react to any situation. There is a time to grow up and take our own responsiblities on. Sadly, some never will. They will alway play the victim. Thank goodness the Apostles never played the victim–they became “Salt and Light.”
fishon
LOL……….All I can say is this is my kinda Church………….lets all praise Pastor David, the master at getting us all talking.
Had a pox on my house this week in the form of a stomach virus that’s altered my perception of reality a bit…
After having a literal bad taste in my own mouth, got to thinking about the emotional aftertastes we all seem to have that color our perceptions.
For some “church” feels like freedom, rebirth, and restoration — for others, it’s slavery, death, and degeneration…
Wrote a longer blog post on this today, if anyone’s interested…
Personally, I love a good blog fight (especially on someone else’s blog) — less blood than the real thing
Steve,
Didn’t realize you had a site. I’ll check it out.
MAKE IT a great weekend.
fishon
T4T -
“are we masking or de-masking?” That is a GREAT question!!!!!
I think if people are using church as a way to stay busy and take up time to not have to deal with the pain in their lives, they are probably at risk for saying yeah, that’s addition.
Hadn’t thought of it that way….
addiction…not addition (Duh!)
…a little Freudian slip there Laura…as in,adding to their problems
Jesus and Addiction: A Prescription to Transform the Dysfunctional Church and Recover Authentic Christianity by Don Williams.
This is probably the only good “Christian” book on addiction I have ever read. Most of the others were based more on favorite theologies than any practical or relevant strategies for successfully dealing with addiction.
Laura,
If I had your email I could send you an explanation. It is a little long-winded for this post
Greggmac – click on my name and you can post your response on my blog under the “Exactly” thread.
I think I can get your email addy off there and neither of us will have to post ours and get attacked by spambots….
Later…