The pastor’s ego must be crucified if the pastor would love.
Yesterday the worship leader started and people interjected with things they wanted to share. People spoke here and there sprinkled among the several songs. People prayed for others. There was fellowship. Encouragement happened. It was a good day for the community. A really good day. And I watched it all happen.
As noon approached that I realized I wouldn’t be speaking that day. Besides, pretty much everything I wanted to say had already been said. I was silent as the service was carried along by others. When it was all said and done no one would’ve recognized who the pastor was. I didn’t need to be there. The rest of the day I was rather sober in my thoughts as I considered what all this might mean. On one level I could feel threatened, useless, replaceable, disposable, unappreciated. But on another level I was incredibly impressed with the community. They really don’t need me. They teach each other, pray for each other, encourage each other, help each other, love each other, all without my help, thank you very much.
I sense I am on the brink of a whole new way of living within this community, this fellowship of friends. And this community is on the brink of a whole new way of being a community. It excites me and scares me at the same time. They are my friends. I am theirs. They are my peers. I am their theirs. They are my pastors. I am theirs. They are my sinners. I am theirs. They are my saints. I am theirs. They are my brothers and sisters, my mothers and fathers, my children. And I am their father, their brother, their son. As my leadership grows no longer necessary, as my prominence is no longer required, as my face is no longer front page, as my body is no longer conspicuous, our mutual love will be shared, less hindered by rank. At one point I will meet the cross. Then I will truly consider as dung all my seminary education, my pastoral experience, my church life, and my theological knowledge and finally become one with them, my people.
Contributions to nakedpastor are greatly appreciated.
David Hayward is a pastor artistically stripping to the essential.
As our church begins its search for a new rector, I have been thinking a lot about the dependence formed between pastor and congregation. The right leader can invigorate a community and help it to flourish. But how much is that community really flourishing if it falls apart when its leader moves on?
In my denomination, rectors are expected to move on after 7 or so years. I’ve seen seemingly strong churches fall apart when a beloved rector goes away. I think it is a credit both to you as a pastor and to the community you’ve helped nurture that they can get along without you. After all, wasn’t that the model that Paul set? Stay a while, teach, move on.
I don’t know how your church feels about its pastors moving on, but it sounds like should the time come that you feel called elsewhere, you can go secure in the knowledge that you’re not leaving wreckage behind you.
“They are my friends. I am theirs. They are my peers. I am their theirs. They are my pastors. I am theirs. They are my sinners. I am theirs. They are my saints. I am theirs. They are my brothers and sisters, my mothers and fathers, my children. And I am their father, their brother, their son. ” – NP
Wow! I am excited and happy to hear this. Probably if a church like this existed where I was, I would be a different person. Good post and keep up the good work!
actually, i don’t see this as meaning i need to move on.
Glad you and your congregation had a great day. Enjoy it. It will not last, because of their sinful nature, they will naturally gravitate towards’ the self’. That’s when they’ll need you to steer them back to Christ.
I have got to say…this is a beautiful thing! I kinda wish I was there to experience your community – I really enjoy engaging in different worship services to share with my brothers and sisters their way of worshipping our Father…maybe I’ll take a trip at some point and visit, besides, I am due to go back east…I miss the ocean!!!
I pray you have many more experiences like this! …And certainly, ENJOY the moment!!
mp:)
beautiful.
and beautifully written.
(this is the experience of our community as well)
Steve,
Though what you said is probably not a popular thought in this blog, you are absolutely right. It is only a matter of time with the ones in the church now, and what of the new ones that will come in the doors?
fishon
I wish we could also have something like this in our church.
Gordon Lathrop writes in his book “The Pastor” about how the presider’s (pastor) role is not only the be the one talking and leading in worship. It is also the role of the presider to give up leadership when appropriate and to direct their attention to who is leading. To lead by not leading, to invite others into community and into the worship of the assembly by letting community invite itself.
The job of the pastor is to speak and preside in worship, and to give up their speech and to give up their presidency. But most importantly, it is to honour the God given calling that the community they pastor has issued by being the pastor that the community requires and at once being ministered to by that community.
Fishon,
Well said. “It is only a matter of time.”
After all…we are what we are, and left to our own devices we will surely run amuck.
Steve
“Glad you and your congregation had a great day. Enjoy it. It will not last, because of their sinful nature, they will naturally gravitate towards’ the self’. That’s when they’ll need you to steer them back to Christ.”
Wow, Steve, you must be neck deep in some nasty doo doo. I cant believe comments like this. These are the ones that make me really wonder if there is a Satan and hes stuck way up someones a………
A small community I’m privileged to be part of was discussing the theme in Hebrews about Jesus being our High Priest. After reading several passages from Hebrews regarding this “new covenant”, some in the group expressed the belief that this concept referred specifically to the destruction of the Jewish ceremonial laws.
Others commented that they believed this revolutionary concept had not been fully embraced by the Catholic church with its belief that truth must come through a Pope or human priest.
I just sat there and thought about the modern Protestant church has much in common with the Old Testament Jews and Catholics, too. Many churches and church people give lip service to this passage saying Christ is our High Priest and mediator. But they cannot fathom a community functioning without an additional layer in the flowchart–a human leader, head, boss, truth-interpreter, guide, (pick your synonym.) We talked for quite some time about what Hebrews 8:10-12 really implies…
I think your family is on to something wonderful, David. And I celebrate such a community with you from afar. In my opinion, the best “leaders” are those who are, at their very core and intention, simply “one of the group.”
John T.
What Steve said is just reality. Heaven comes later for the Christian; it is not here on earth.
And really, all that Steve said was, there will come a time when they will need leadership, again. I am trying to think of some kind of organization, community, or whatever you want to call groups that don’t need some kind of leadership at some point. Can you?
fishon
Fishon
Timing is everything. Let the man enjoy the day. Surely a Christian can understand that.
I’ve had a fairly similar experience. We have a very small church that don’t have too many people who can provide leadership in the traditional sense. Yet the Spirit still works through them.
A few months ago we had our Mothers’ Day service. I had a pretty good sermon written. Yet through the prayers and everything else that went on I picked up on a fair bit of grief that was going through the congregation. The themes coming out were pretty raw and not too eloquent; however, it was clear God was directing the traffic. We pray that he will every week. It was a little bizarre to actually see it happen.
The scripture reading I’d chosen was relevant, but the sermon itself was right off base. I read the Bible reading and summed up in about three minutes what God seemed to be saying through everyone else. It (what God was doing, not my off the cuff sermon) made a huge impact.
What’s more, I’ve still got a pretty good Mothers’ Day sermon for next year!
John T.
The thing is John, when NP writes, he is writing not only to share a good day, but part of the reason he blogs is to influence, and to a certain degree, convince others of his positions and beliefs. He is the last person to not expect that people are going to react to his words, some positive, some negative.
And by the way, if what Steve wrote, and I agree with, ruins his day so as to not enjoy it, then it really wasn’t that good of a day.
And too, Steve or I don’t expect NP to agree with us in everything with say, and that doesn’t stop us from enjoying the day cause he does not see things are way.
By the way, if we pastors enjoy a Sunday based on someone disagreeing with us, we would never have a great Sunday.
fishon
Very exciting, David. Having tasted this, doesn’t it just wreck you for anything less?
you see, this is the problem. to assume that what i did(n’t) do wasn’t leadership.
David, I would have like to have been present in that service, although I also believe that part of what a congregation shares is its common-unity with each other. We, the Church in general, have fallen away from such corporal worship, I think, expecting the pastor and the choir to provide us with that commodity. While I have nothing against a good sermon (and, by “good”, I simply mean I hope to find a flow of God’s Spirit in the message), what I expect of my pastor is his knowledge that he is no more than a vessel for that Spirit. Whether the Holy Ghost makes His presence known through the words he brings forth from the pulpit, via some song however shared, or by personal testimonies given from the pew, the blessing remains at His discretion and the best we can do is learn to recognize “the real deal”, learn also that we cannot “make it come to pass”, but surrender ourselves unto it when it does. My pastor is my leader, my earthly shepherd. I expect only to find Christ in him as well as humanity, and honesty on both sides of the issue. We are in this stumble together. You, my friend, sound like a man I could follow…
“Timing is everything. Let the man enjoy the day. Surely a Christian can understand that. ” – John T
Apparently not.
“people are going to react to his words, some positive, some negative” Fishon
True, but some people always seem to be negative.
“you see, this is the problem. to assume that what i did(n’t) do wasn’t leadership. ” NP
I understand what you are saying. Some churches (if not most) do not lead a congregation, they lead a sunday program that has been layed out for them since the dark ages. stand, pray, sing, sit listen, sing and leave. With the occasional breakout of creativity.
But you have an opportunity to lead your common-unity somewhere that is in yours and their hearts and I encourage you to do so. For me, true spirituality is the connection of something bigger than your self.
Fishon, John T.,
Thanks for defending what I said. I appreciate it. You said just what I would have said.
John T.,
I do believe I said to NP to enjoy the day. I meant it. I know David is not an idiot. I know he realizes that the communal bliss they expereienced that day will not last.
If we can’t discuss this stuff in terms of reality and mention future scenarios or implications of our actions and beliefs then we might as well hang out at Disneyworld all day and say everything’s just ducky. Then we would be idiots.
I’ve got news for you. Everything ain’t ‘just ducky’. You mentioned Satan. He is real, and he is after us. And the evil that is in the world, and that we all have within us is bad enough.
A theology of the cross, always brings us back to reality.
Thanks.
– Steve M.
“You mentioned Satan. He is real, and he is after us. And the evil that is in the world, and that we all have within us is bad enough.” S&M
“Probably the most well know sermon ever preached is called, “Sinners in the hands of an angry God.— Fishon from I see Dead Trees walking
So satan and god are both after us. That’s what I mean. too much negativity. It seems like faith doesn’t give people a reason to celebrate or feel joy . Just sit around waiting for either the devil to get them when they are good. Or a god when they are bad or good (cause if you believe in the wrong type of god, he is still going to get you). it’s this type of thinking that lead me to be an unbeliever.
I agree that there is enough “evil that is in the world, and that we all have within us is bad enough” , but when even god doesn’t give you a break. wow. why live?
All I am trying to say is that faith should be there to step up and encourage and help a brother when he is down. Not remind him that there is a ground when he is flying high. Let him fly!
Steve
Ive got some news for you. God created evil.
Isaiah 45:7
I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create EVIL: I the LORD do all these things.
If you’ve read earlier entries from my blog, you would realize that this sunday was anything but bliss. we’re a sinful lot. the point i’m making is that the sinful lot of us all got along without visible leadership.
David
Who needs a leader when youre sinning…………..just give me the …..oops cant say that on here
David — been reading your blog for awhile — I appreciate your openness and honesty about what you’re experiencing.
Dying to self is never pretty and painless, but it’s necessary if we’re to step out of the way and point people to Christ. Seems to me that’s what pastoring should be all about…
Wilfred Bird,
God has done something about this problem! He has solved it for us! We ought rejoice in it! But we need to also realize that the battle rages on, and that we ought realize that in this life, there will be no heaven on earth, other than the Christ who lives within us (Fishon said that, too).
Keepin’ it real…that’s all.
John T.,
God can create whatever He wants. So what? He has also solved the problem of evil on the cross. But we still have to deal with it until the new creation is brought in it’s fulness by Jesus.
Steve
“God has done something about this problem! He has solved it for us! We ought rejoice in it! But we need to also realize that the battle rages on”
If the battle rages on, he obviously hasnt solved Shit.
This is exactly what I want.
John,
The two kingdoms doctrine. Saint and sinner simultaneously. Spiritual warfare. Paradoxes of the Christian faith. Awww…never mind.
Dave,
Thanks for sharing your thoughts…
To others:
Sheeesh…talk about pissing on the guy’s parade…
Nathan,
Read the Sermon on the Mount if you want to see a guy really piss on your parade.
Can I visit your community?! Please . . .
What a wonderful feeling, huh? To go from fear of being no longer being needed to the realization of freedom as you continue to lead eachother.
Next time something goes wrong the congregation won’t need their all powerful pastor to steer them back, they will work it out with or whithout your help.